Search

  • Google

    WWW
    esbalogh.typepad.com

News around the World

  • Pusztaranger: Neues aus Ungarn
    An excellent German-language blog on Hungary
  • Galamus-Csoport
    A Hungarian-language internet paper. News and opinions by leading Hungarian commentators. galamus.hu
  • JeToTak
    A Slovak website that provides readers with analyses and commentaries on domestic and world events. The language is Slovak, but the editors are experimenting with the introduction of some English language items, including selected articles from Hungarian Spectrum.

« An embarrassing retreat for Viktor Orbán and his government | Main | Total confusion in Budapest »

June 06, 2010

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00e009865ae588330133f03b1b33970b

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference Alternative to Trianon?:

Comments

Sandor

Now, that the EU and its borderless state is upon us, perhaps not much point to phantasize about the may have been.
But as I look at that map, no matter how disagreeable the crown prince was, in light of all the wonderful accolades about present day Austria, this could have worked.
Yes, it would have eliminated the privileged status of Hungarians, but what did it get for us? How privileged are we now? How much was this privilege worth?
Of course, there is the fact also that Austria is the most livable country on Earth, perhaps because it doesn't have to drag along all those backward provinces.
On the other hand, the whole of Europe and the world had to take an enormously costly detour at a cost of two world wars and a loss of a short century, to reach at a state by now that could have been attained in or around 1920, had nationalism and its fiends not kiboshed it for their silly reasons. They are discredited and gone too, alas, not forever, but the opportunity is also gone and the whole project had to be started from square one again.
As it is today, most of the territories of that map are part of the EU already, or about to become so.
But then, what was all that fuss about for eighty years? And if it was all so futile as it undoubtedly was, how come that the nationalists are still doing their shtick, and have not learned anything from the past? Could it be that to be a good nationalist you must be an ignorant idiot?

Paul

You can find a more detailed map in here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Greater_austria_ethnic.svg

and another one in here
http://www.thomasgraz.net/glass/map-popov.htm

Yes, The HU-RO border is further to the east but Oradea (Nagyvárad) and Timisoara(Temesvár)are in Transylvania; it's harder to determine were Arad would have been.
It was an interesting plan; I remember hearing about it during my studies.

Miro

I do not find this idea bad, but it was not very reallistic. Problem was, that such a programme would be absolutelly unacceptable for the Hungarian policy (what profit would they have?) and for Austrian-German politics, too. Such a programme would be very popular with Slavic politics in the Monarchy and maybe for a part of the ruling dynasty. But it was really not enough.
This federalisation could be forced only as a common deal in Hungarian and Austrian Diet. Do you think, that it would pass? I don´t think so.

Matt L

Certainly, there were other options besides Trianon. It was clear to everyone that something needed to change in the organization of the Dual Monarchy. But any change after World War One would have been something imposed on the Hungarians by someone from outside. Trianon was a product of the British, French, Italians, and Americans. Central Europa would have been imposed by the Germans. No matter how pretty the package, it would have been forced on the Hungarian political leadership because they would have lost some of their power.

Unfortunately, the last opportunity for reform in peacetime was probably the 1905/06 Constitutional crisis. That was Franz Joseph's last chance to impose democracy 'from above' on the Hungarian aristocracy and gentry. But in the end he preferred to deal with the Aristos and not the Socialists. As Miro suggests, when given the chance, neither the 48-er or Compromise parties opted for universal manhood (or god forbid, just plain universal adult) suffrage. They didn't want the national minorities and their own peasants to have the vote. Period.

Throughout the twentieth century Hungarian politicians used Nationalism to bludgeon Liberalism to death. Lets see if Hungarian politicians and citizens, who now have the vote, can improve on their record from a hundred years ago.

Attila

NEW alternative?

Trianon in the Europa Parlament

http://trianon-dilemma.blogspot.com/

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been posted. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment

Blog powered by TypePad

  • Google Analytics rev